Legal Immigrants vs. Illegal Immigrants
I live in a Democrat household and for the mostpart agree with the Democrat philosophy. However, I am disgusted with the way Some Democrat senotors are standing up for illegal immigrants. Americans are homeless, because they cannot find work, or their former employers fired them because he could pay an illegal immigrants half the wages. This is so wrong. Why are Democrat Senators placing the neeeds and "wants" of illegal immigrants ahead of American citizens? Is it in desperation to get more votes? Is someone profitting from this? Special interest groups are raping our country and anyone that condones it should be imprisoned for treason. Honor, patriotism and ethics have been replaced with greed and corruption. Democrats are just as guilty as Republicans.
Please stop the madness now.
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Well Muffiinabundant@yahoo.com...
you do realize don't you that there are laws on the books concerning the hiring of illegal aliens(they are not immigrants). The Bush administration has seen fit not to go after any employers who do hire these people. Since the jobs are there, these people will continue to come...any way they can. If the employers were to be fined and perhaps jailed for hiring them, the abuses you speak of would quickly end. Do you not agree?
While you are at it, why not refer to our Democratic senators by their rightful title. Democrat senators will not cut it.
As to Democratic senators, or even politicians for that matter, the Dems have not been in control of anything for over 6 years now. The people going to trial and on to prison all seem to be Republican. How can you claim that both are equally guilty?
Also remember that these are illegal aliens being discussed. There are no illegal immigrants as such--all bonified immigrants have filed the necessary paperwork and have been accepted into the country legally.
A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.
Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623
The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.
Louis Pasteur
The Laws
I'm very aware of the laws. I'm also aware that the laws are not being enforced. At least they weren't up until recently. I'm very glad to see the recent mirage of good intentions. I'm proud of those Americans that have stood against illegal immigration.
Were I starving, would it be OK to bust into your home and raid your fridge, without your permission?
Maybe I need a car but can't afford one. Can I take yours, without your permission?
What if all the people that were starving in America - you know, the homeless people that lost their jobs to illegal aliens - would they have the right to march for the right to steal food from those that have it, without asking their permission?
grinch: "Democrat" vs. "Democratic"
>While you are at it, why not refer to our Democratic senators by their rightful title. Democrat senators will not cut it.
I imagine you know this, grinch, but that is a bastardization fostered by the far right (particularly prevalent among many televised evangelical preachers) in an attempt to, as the dictionary defines "bastardization" - "reduce from a higher to a lower state or condition" (Webster's).
Of course, the misuse of the noun "Democrat" as the adjective "Democratic" was a slight, and seemingly subtle, skewing of the language that facilitated the further denigrating of the party and its adherents by paving the way for other slams: "demoncrats" and "democRATS" are familiar message board slurs.
As we've known all along, but controlling and bastardizing the language and its authentic meaning, the truly nefarious agenda of the far right is obscured. One example of that was the 2000 election aftermath, when many Democrats, in an effort to get the votes counted, were derided for (ostensibly) not recognizing that we live in a republic. The underlying message, of course, was that the votes didn't need to be counted, as the representatives could vote however they wished, regardless of how the state's citizens voted.
Yeah Chip...I am well aware of the derivation of the word ...
democrat/democratic...and also of the use of the word at Freeperville and other oddball sites. I was just attempting to draw the nice lady out.
One of the major problems in this country today is that we all speak various forms of English...only a small group prefers to use the language as it is supposed to be used. Some say that it makes no difference...8^)...but of course, it does make a difference.
And some of their strange words are right out of Newtie's GOPAC dictionary.
Advantage to us as the red flags go up.
A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.
Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623
The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.
Louis Pasteur
Tip of the Muffinabundant, er,
cap to you, grinch!
I dunno about Muffinabundant Chip...
Perhaps she should turn her name around. Abundantmuffin sounds more appetizing somehow.
She tends to forget Pete Wilson, staunch Republican and former mayor of San Diego as well as, gov. of CA, who had illegal aliens working in his home. When questioned about this, 'Ol Pete said"I didn't know they were illegal. Hmmm.
And then, there was the late great Linda Chavez--one of Bush's nominees for the Secty. of Labor slot. She had an illegal alien working for her...and it prevented her from getting the nod for the Secty's job.
Oh the list is practically endless. But in the end, the abundantmuffin has decided, unilaterally, that it is the Dem's fault.
Life is a wondrous thing.
A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.
Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623
The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.
Louis Pasteur
Muffinabundant Isn't Confused by Facts
She knows in her heart she's right. Her president and preacher said so. And it spares her from the facts and thinking about what they mean.
Aw shucks Chip...I forgot to bring up the...
Huffingtons and their one-time illegal staff. That was before Arianna had to support herself by writing.
A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.
Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623
The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.
Louis Pasteur
That was the best move Arianna made.
She's her own person now, quite different
from her role as Michael Huffington's wife.
Exactly grinch
If you don't say what you mean. How can you mean what you say. The details are everything.
Happy holidays , Merry x-mas, happy kwaanza, Happy hannakaa.
Yup Ole, people can't or won't speak English...
as it is meant to be spoken. Instead they rely on their local dialects which leave a lot of confusion. Many of these people spent their school daze[intentional]sitting in the back row talking about girls/boys instead of learning their so-called mother tongue.
Happy Festiva to y'all.
A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.
Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623
The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.
Isaac Asimov
Isaac made the argument that English would not change too much, so that Shakespeare's mythic works would remain readable in the language of the day.
I have to say, that whenever I read a little Shakespeare, I am blown away by his insights. He seems other worldly.
I dunno Jim...if you think in terms of about...
500 years from Shakespere to the present and consider the degradation of the English language(daily speech) and then revisit Chaucer's English usage--another 500 year trip further into the past, you find that sometime in the next 100 years or so, translators will be necessary for WS.
To go further into this, the English used by both Chaucer and Shakespere was very distinct and specific. Today's poor excuse for English is essentially an amorphous blob where meanings are usually missing.
The difference is similar to the difference between the Koine and Attic Greek...virtually two different languages.
English has roughly 700,000 + words in it's vocabulary. Most of our citizens--here and in Britain--use about 3000 words. There is a serious problem if we attempt to understand each other.
A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.
Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623
The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.
I agree...
...that the change seems more rapid than ole Isaac was musing about. I understand the sentiment though as Will never fails to shock me.
Then again, I'm awed whenever I see a grade school kid with brains. Extrapolating backwards from adults would seemingly not allow for any intellect in pre teen years. Seems like something goes awry after ~5th grade. Kid's too worried about the opinion of peers to be fascinated? I don't know.
I'll have to look into Koine and Attic Greek.
Hey, you can twist the words
Hey, you can twist the words all you want. Corruption is corruption. Why would any American want to allow peoples from another country to come here under the Homeland Security radar and then reward them for doing so? I'll tell you why, profit and power. Illegal immigrants(a person that migrates to a foreign country without documentation) are here for one purpose, to supply American businesses with cheap and illegal labor. Maybe if they are given amnesty they can vote for those that betrayed the trust of American citizens by putting their selfish reasons ahead of their professional obligation. Why do we allow this instead of using diplomacy with Mexico to entice them to fix their own ecomony instead of coming to the U.S.A. and ruining ours. Legal immigration rocks! Illegal immigration sucks! For those that cry "there's no such thing as an illegal" need to respect the laws of this country or leave.
Just so that I understand you...
You're saying that the only purpose illegal immigrants are here is to "supply American businesses with cheap and illegal labor," so why is it an 'illegal immigration' problem and not an 'illegal hiring' problem? I mean, I don't think these people just wake up one morning and say to themselves, 'Hey! I think I'll supply America with cheap, illegal labor today!'
I would be more inclined to believe that they come here to take the jobs employers aren't willing to pay living wages for so that they can feed their families and have a better life. Now I do find it easier to believe that there are corporate boards in the US that sit around big, wooden tables and say, 'Hey, it's cheaper to hire illegals than to pay a living wage to Americans who are without work and we're here to make profit.'
So why isn't it a 'illegal employment practices problem?
I do agree with you here:
For those that cry "there's no such thing as an illegal" need to respect the laws of this country or leave.
Tell that to the corporations getting fat from illegal hiring practices. I don't think they've missed any meals - do you?
Conservative. A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from a Liberal, who wishes to replace them with others.
~Ambrose Bierce, 1842-1914, American Author, Editor, Journalist.
immigration
Submarine USS Wahoo ss238
Blame the big corporations that use these quote 'illegal
immigrants' in their quest for the almighty dollar.
As this is a subject we need to address, we must first
take care of our own people, and stop sending our tax dollars
over to Iraq.
This issue has been around for years, but with the GW Bush
admin it always "All of a sudden", just like it is with
Social Security, Terra, etc.
Enough blame to go around, no?
Both sides have pandered to the illegal community to get them into their voting pockets. When Americans decide to get together on this issue and stop coddling lawbreakers (both the workers who enter illegally and those that hire them and benefit from cheap labor) we may see a solution.
Do you have a source to back
Do you have a source to back up your claim that "illegals" actually vote?
Or are you referring to the American Hispanic community in general, and their prominent position in U.S. politics?
gewehrmonkey--when you speak of 'cheap' labor...
Keep in mind that Kansas(Brownback)has a minimum wage law giving $2.65/hr.
Must be fun to be an American in Kansas.
A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.
Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623
The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.
Louis Pasteur
kansas
Submarine USS Wahoo ss238
I heard that 'Dorothy' works at the local Wal-Mart
and makes that rate, Toto on the other hand gets half
that amount due to the 'Almira Gulch' law that went
in to effect in 2001.
I think they should be using
I think they should be using e verify and screening all the employees to see if they are legally documented or not especially with the economy and so many people out of work it'd be nice if the first people in line for a job were our citizens.
Maybe if they paid ....
Maybe if they paid (the corporations) everyone a living wage instead of just hoarding all the wealth for themselves. There would be no illegal immingrant problem. Also I doubt there would be an economic downturn (recession) if not so much wealth was concentrated at the top. 400-500 of the people here controlling 40% of the wealth. People might be able to buy a car go shopping etc. It really is simple economics, I think the folks in congress should live on minimium wage for a bit and see how they like it. Lets say a year guess what the minimum wage would go up so fast it would make your head spin.
Illegal Aliens
>Americans are homeless, because they cannot find work, or >their former employers fired them because he could pay an >illegal immigrants half the wages. This is so wrong. Why are >Democrat Senators placing the neeeds and "wants" of illegal >immigrants ahead of American citizens?
Can you also admit that illegal aliens are NOT being payed a living wage? Have you seen where they live on wages that undermine this country? It's appalling conditions that would be considered below "below poverty" if any U.S. American citizen where in such a situation. This is also WRONG.
And I agree...it is undermining this country because companies wont pay living wages to legal immigrants and citizens.
And THAT is the problem...because what companies WONT pay.
The only reason why they are payed less is because illegal aliens more and more are living under the threat of not only deportation but legal prosecution. Employers have an interest in that. How else could they pay less without leverage over their workers? If they pay less to some legal immigrant or citizen, that person can go on strike or SUE! That person has rights! That person has a minimum wage!
So why not level the playing field? Giving illegal aliens rights like everyone else will take away the ability of employers to take advantage of illegal workers. Now the hiring pool is composed of everyone in this country...not just those that have no right to stand up for themselve (i.e. illegals)
it's in the capitalist's interest to have these virtual slaves...and how do you make them slaves? You make laws against them and enforce those, while ignoring laws against companies. You threaten the immigrants with deadly force, and economics. it's time to free them. So is the answer then to make illegal aliens even more "illegal"?
>Please stop the madness now.
Yes, stop it.